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quote: For the last 2 years, you've had two editions of DWtS, then FOX has its summer So You Think You Can Dance, then ABC ads a third Dance Wars.
Now, Lifetime has Your mama Don't Dance and I saw some show on MTV that was a "hipper" dance competiton show.
By the time DWtS hits its fall premiere, you will have had about 24 straight months of Dancing Competitions shows. Will there be viewer burnout on the genre?
The thing that has given AI the legs it has is that it is only on for 5 months of the year and no other show can really do what it does.
TV-aholic, I feel like deja-vu, because I could swear we had this discussion before. And as I pointed out last time, none of these new Dancing shows have the same or similar format to DWTS. The only show to have anything associated with DWTS was Dance War, and I'm not sure it is returning. The other shows are marginal cable shows trying to exploit DWTS' popularity: the best one of them, Your Mama Don't Dance, still only pulls in 1.5 million viewers. So I don't see the overexposure you see. AI had much more clones and spin-offs a few years ago, with its own American Kids (or something), the new Star Search, Nashville Star, and countless other "nich" singing competitions. I don't understand why you think there could be so many singing competitions that will not affect AI but a few dancing shows will affect DWTS. Both AI and DWTS are a unique combination of the format, judges, contestants, etc and can't be simply replicated by having another show with singing or dancing in it. Just ask "The Next American Band" if that's the case or not... |
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quote: Originally posted by pisher: quote: I think the horrible lead in is really hurting NA. If it had SCC's lead-in and lack of competition, I think NA could be getting ratings at least comparable to SCC.
And it would have an excellent shot at getting canceled in its second season, like SCC. 
Quite possibly, but the fact remains that it would be doing significantly better (ratings wise) if it had a decent lead-in. |
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quote: Quite possibly, but the fact remains that it would be doing significantly better (ratings wise) if it had a decent lead-in.
Well yeah, this is what I've been saying, and this is why Marc doesn't have it on his loser's list. But of course, if the lead-in is better, if the timeslot is better, if the competition is weaker, then the expectations go up. And the ratings had better go well up along with them. Not just a little. Really, all these shows (SCC, PD, NA) are below the point where they'd be canceled under normal circumstances. The circumstances are decidedly abnormal, and that's giving them a little longer to prove that their low ratings are no fluke. |
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I thought this even before Lifetime's entry into the genre. I'm not sure that Dancing has the long term strength as a show like AI. I think the "burnout" will come in the fall (if it happens). That will be the 24 month mark. The element that helped AI was that most of the show that tried to comepte with it were not accepted by the viewing public, so the Burnout never really happened. Those others fell while the Mighty AI grew. Not sure that will be the case with DWtS. quote: Originally posted by Chimera:
TV-aholic, I feel like deja-vu, because I could swear we had this discussion before. And as I pointed out last time, none of these new Dancing shows have the same or similar format to DWTS. The only show to have anything associated with DWTS was Dance War, and I'm not sure it is returning. The other shows are marginal cable shows trying to exploit DWTS' popularity: the best one of them, Your Mama Don't Dance, still only pulls in 1.5 million viewers. So I don't see the overexposure you see.
AI had much more clones and spin-offs a few years ago, with its own American Kids (or something), the new Star Search, Nashville Star, and countless other "nich" singing competitions. I don't understand why you think there could be so many singing competitions that will not affect AI but a few dancing shows will affect DWTS. Both AI and DWTS are a unique combination of the format, judges, contestants, etc and can't be simply replicated by having another show with singing or dancing in it. Just ask "The Next American Band" if that's the case or not...
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| Posts: 15584 | Location: Indiana | Registered: 20 September 2006 | |
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quote: Originally posted by Ginger: quote: Originally posted by Obveeus:
We can now officially call New Amsterdam a 'flop'.
Amen. The only "positive" is that this airing didn't loose 25% of the audience from the previous week's episode. As for Canterbury’s Law, percentage wise, it didn't loose as much as New Amsterdam did between episodes WITH the ratings titian American Idol as a lead in. Don't get me wrong, I doubt both shows will be back and that's fine with me. More available slots of JJ Abram's Fringe and Joss Whedon's Dollhouse.
I am enjoying both Canterbury's Law and New Amsterdam. Canterbury's Law is so dark and anti-heroish, and it reminds me much of the better episodes of The Practice. And New Amsterdam is an excellent example of neo noir for the small screen, with an excellent lead, clever writing and superb direction. If Mr. Reilly wants to give Canterbury's Law a real test, I would advise him to flip time periods with House on Friday. Canterbury's Law might find its audience on the less competitive Fridays, and a 1.7 A18-49 (100% retention from its debut episode) on Fridays will look much better vis-a-vis the competition. And thank you kind Ginger for reminding those of whose who cleave to quality television that even should Canterbury and Amsterdam be felled an untimely demise, both Mr. Abram's Fringe and Mr. Whedon's Dollhouse are just around the corner. To quote Maria, "When the Lord closes a door, somewhere He opens a window. " |
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quote: I am enjoying both Canterbury's Law and New Amsterdam.
As if things didn't look dark enough for them already.  |
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quote: Originally posted by pisher:
Really, all these shows (SCC, PD, NA) are below the point where they'd be canceled under normal circumstances.
Except one of those three shows will be canceled. quote: The circumstances are decidedly abnormal, and that's giving them a little longer to prove that their low ratings are no fluke.
How convenient, you are never wrong, it is all because of the strike. I wonder why KVille and BS are not coming back. 
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| Posts: 611 | Location: NYC | Registered: 02 November 2007 | |
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ABC spin: quote:
Quick Take for Monday, March 17, 2008
(Fast Affiliate Live + Same Day Ratings)
With the Return of "Dancing with the Stars" Leading into "The Bachelor," ABC Posts a Definitive Monday Night Victory in Viewers and Adults 18-49
ABC Posts its Strongest Monday Since November in Total Viewers and Adults 18-49, While Hitting a Season High Among Adults 18-34
Opposite Stiff All-Original Competition, ABC's Sixth Season Opener for "Dancing
With the Stars" Emerges as Monday's No. 1 TV Show in Viewers and All Key Adults
"DWTS" Wins Each of its Half-Hours to Outpace its Closest Competition
In the Time Period by 9.9 Million Viewers and by 22% Among Adults 18-49
"Dancing" Generates ABC's Best Adult 18-34 Number in its Time Period in 1 Year
In its Season Opener, "The Bachelor: London Calling" Wins its Time Slot in Adults 18-34 and Ranks as Monday's No. 2 TV Show in Women 18-34, behind only "DWTS"
Monday Night (8:00-11:00 p.m.)
With the sixth season premiere of "Dancing With the Stars" on the night leading into the opener for "The Bachelor: London Calling," ABC stood as the No. 1 TV network on Monday in viewers and young adults. The Network outpaced second-place CBS on the night by 4.3 million viewers (14.9 million vs. 10.6 million - CBS) and by 13% in Adults 18-49 (4.4/12 vs. 3.9/10).
* ABC turned in its strongest performance on the night since November in Total Viewers and Adults 18-49 (since 11/19/07), while marking a Monday season high among Adults 18-34 (3.7/11 - best since 5/21/07.
* ABC's broad appealing "Dancing with the Stars" qualified as Monday's No. 1 TV program in Total Viewers and across each of the key adult demos (AD18-34/AD18-49/AD25-54).
"Dancing with the Stars" (8:00-9:30 p.m.)
Despite facing stiff all-original competition in its sixth season premiere, including the return of CBS' 8:00-10:00 p.m. comedy block, NBC's unscripted series ("My Dad is Better than Your Dad"/"Deal or No Deal") and Fox's first-run dramas ("Canterbury's Law"/"New Amsterdam"), ABC's "Dancing with the Stars" won each of its half-hours and soared to the top of its time period. "Dancing with the Stars" outdrew its nearest competition (CBS) by 9.9 million viewers (20.9 million vs. 11.0 million) and by 22% in Adults 18-49 (5.5/15 vs. 4.5/12).
* The return of "DWTS" generated ABC's largest audience and top Adult 18-49 rating in the time period in 4 months - since 11/19/07. The hit ABC unscripted series marked the Net's highest Adult 18-34 number in the slot in almost 1-year - since 3/26/07.
"The Bachelor: London Calling" (9:30-11:00 p.m.)
ABC's "The Bachelor: London Calling" opened with an average audience of 9.0 million viewers and a 3.3 rating, 9 share in Adults 18-49. The show took second place in its time period among Adults 18-49 (3.3/9-tie) and ranked No. 1 among Adults 18-34 (3.4/10), Women 18-49 (5.0/12) and Women 18-34 (5.0/13). In fact trailing only "DWTS," "The Bachelor" stood as the No. 2 TV program on Monday among its core audience of Women 18-34.
* "The Bachelor: London Calling" produced ABC's top viewer and young adult (AD18-34/AD18-49) numbers with regular programming in the time period since November - since 11/19/07.
A note about increasing DVR penetration and year-to-year rating comparisons: Year-to-year rating trends based on the Live + Same Day data stream may be somewhat distorted by the level of DVR penetration in the Nielsen sample, which has jumped from over 13% at the same point in 2006, up to more than 23% currently. More viewers are watching shows on their own timetables, which may not be reflected in the overnight next day numbers. The only truly valid year-to-year comparison would be one based on the Live + 7 Day metric, once those stats are released by Nielsen.
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It could have something to do with facing Two and a Half Men. Perhaps some viewers have had enough of reality TV and were just happy to have scripted programming back on. Great numbers for CBS. quote: Originally posted by TravisYanan: quote: Originally posted by spotupj:
So much for HIMYM's "bubble" status. Couldn't have imagined those kinds of numbers, and it is a bona fide "winner" in my book. And Big Bang returned within a couple hundred K of where it was when its originals ended, despite the tougher slot.
I'm (pleasantly) shocked at HIMYM gaining a full point in the demo over its season premiere in September. And this despite going up against DWTS' biggest half-hour (by the way... why is that? I don't recall other reality shows peaking in the middle... or is it due to facing 2.5 Men?)
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| Posts: 7622 | Location: Houston, TX | Registered: 19 November 2006 | |
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quote: Originally posted by Zedman2:
Did DOND runover at the beginning of the hour? The Futon Critic shows Medium having the largest drop in 18-49 at the half-hour (adults 18-49: 3.2, #7, half-hour: -6.06%). The Bachelor only went down by 3.03% while CSI-Miami held steady.
Speaking of the half hour numbers, they hint that New Amsterdam was, indeed, negatively affected by a timeslot runover of Canterberry's Law. Hopefully, that meana that its final numbers will rise. Also, it looks like some DwtS fans do tune in for the end of Pussycat Dolls. |
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CBS spin: quote:
VIEWERS WELCOME BACK ALL NEW EPISODES OF CBS'S MONDAY COMEDIES
"How I Met Your Mother," "Two and a Half Men" and "The New Adventures of Old Christine" Hit Season Highs in Demos
Original Episodes of "The Big Bang Theory," "How I Met Your Mother," "Two and a Half Men" and "Christine" All Out Deliver Their Pre-Strike First-Run Averages
All new episodes of CBS's Monday comedy block successfully returned as original episodes of HOW I MET YOUR MOTHER, TWO AND A HALF MEN and THE NEW ADVENTURES OF OLD CHRISTINE posted season high demographic deliveries, according to Nielsen preliminary live plus same day ratings for March 17.
Every program in the 8:00-10:00 PM comedy block exceeded its pre-strike first run averages in viewers and key demographics.
THE BIG BANG THEORY (P) returned with first run episodes, finishing second in households (5.5/09), viewers (9.11m), adults 25-54 (4.3/11) and adults 18-49 (3.7/11). Compared to the program's live plus same day first-run delivery this season, BIG BANG THEORY was up +2% in adults 25-54 (from 4.2/09), +6% in adults 18-49 (from 3.5/09), added +320,000 viewers (from 8.79m +4%).
HOW I MET YOUR MOTHER (P) was second in households (5.9/09), viewers (9.73m), adults 25-54 (5.0/12) and adults 18-49 (4.3/11). Compared to the program's live plus same day first-run season average, HOW I MET YOUR MOTHER was up +13% in households (from 5.2/08), +32% in adults 25-54 (from 3.8/09), +34% in adults 18-49 (from 3.2/09) and added +1.59m viewers (from 8.14m, +20%). HOW I MET YOUR MOTHER posted season highs in households, viewers, adults 25-54 and adults 18-49.
At 9:00 PM, a new episode of TWO AND A HALF MEN was second in households (8.5/13), viewers (14.03m), adults 25-54 (6.7/15, -0.2 behind ABC) and adults 18-49 (5.4/13, -0.1 behind ABC's "Dancing with the Stars" premiere). Compared to the program's live plus same day first-run season delivery, TWO AND A HALF MEN was up +10% in adults 25-54 (from 6.1/13), +13% in adults 18-49 (from 4.8/11) and added +180,000 viewers (from 13.85m, +1%). This is TWO AND A HALF MEN's best adults 25-54 and adults 18-49 delivery this season.
THE NEW ADVENTURES OF OLD CHRISTINE was first in adults 25-54 (5.5/12), adults 18-49 (4.3/11), second in households (7.2/11) and viewers (11.45m, -0.44m behind NBC). Compared to the program's live plus same day delivery this season, THE NEW ADVENTURES OF OLD CHRISTINE was up +18% in households (from 6.1/09), +34% in both adults 25-54 (from 4.1/09) and adults 18-49 (from 3.2/08) and added +2.13m viewers (from 9.32m, +23%). THE NEW ADVENTURES OF OLD CHRISTINE scored season highs in households, viewers, adults 25-54 and adults 18-49.
CSI: MIAMI returns with new episodes next Monday.
Updated Monday ratings will be available this afternoon.
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quote: Except one of those three shows will be canceled.
ALL of them will be canceled. It's just a matter of which ones get the undeserved and highly temporary reprieve. quote: How convenient, you are never wrong,
How convenient, you always are. You honestly forgot what a lousy demo rating PD got for "Corpsicle", didn't you? About the same rating that you say merits instant cancellation for NA, and on one of the original networks, on a more-watched night of TV. Just blanked it out entirely. Because you never let the facts get in the way of what you WANT to be true.  quote: it is all because of the strike. I wonder why KVille and BS are not coming back.
When you're here, B.S. never leaves, Z. |
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quote: Originally posted by gdfriends: quote: Originally posted by mediumfan: quote: Originally posted by Obveeus: quote: Originally posted by Chimera:
Marc, I don't watch Medium. However, building on its DOND lead-in and beating The Bachelor, which had the benefit of DWTS as a lead-in and a 28 minute head-start deserves being on the winner list in my book.
Medium is still struggling to contend with CSI:Miami reruns.
I wouldn't call beating it in both the households and demo "struggling". Yes, it has struggled up to now, but give them some credit when they do beat it. When CSI:Miami returns with new eps, if they're still beating them, then you can call them a loser. But give them a little credit.
why would medium be a winner??? it loses to csi:miami repeats (ratings) and barely (if that) beats it in the demos...how is that a winner???? a 3.2 demo is not that great...it is nowhere near winner status.
But Marc made the overrated 60 Minutes a winner last night with a 1.8 in the demo. A 3.2 in the demo is honorable mention. |
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| Posts: 331 | Location: Los Angeles, CA | Registered: 27 October 2006 | |
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quote: Originally posted by Zitrone: How convenient, you are never wrong, it is all because of the strike. I wonder why KVille and BS are not coming back.
You do have to admit that there are shows getting a pass because of the strike. DSM would never be renewed without the strike with its consistent downward trends. I doubt Life, AtJ, or PD would have gotten renewed either. While BS and KVille are canceled now, they got a lot longer run than they would have without the strike (same thing with Cane, Cashmere Mafia, October Road, and several others). |
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I didn't find either BBT nor HIMYM that funny last night, and I like both shows, so I hope this won't lead to an audience tune-out next week. I'm happy to see they both did well.
I switched over to "My Dad" and "Deal or No Deal" a bit during the commercial breaks.
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