Why does the "mass appeal hit" qualification have to keep coming up with The Office? Every. Single. Week.
Aaaah, thank you. 100% agree. The Office is already making handfulls of cash for NBC with it's (apparently) "limited appeal"
Agreed, agreed, but the fact remains, NBC could have had a no-qualifications hit here, except that The Office is just too good for NBC Thursday. And by the same token, NBC Thursday is not good enough for The Office.
Originally posted by Marc Berman: But after watching, and loving, last week’s dinner party themed episode, the problem with last night is why the show itself is not a mass appeal hit. There is no one to like on The Office. Steve Carell as Michael is completely obnoxious and the employees of Dunder Mifflin leave very little to be desired. Then again, can you really blame them while working in an environment like that?
Okay, I'll give you that about Michael ... he is completely obnoxious (I wanted to strangle him last night for being such an a** about Pam's landlady, Margaret), but of course that said, let's face it ... "The Office" wouldn't be "The Office" without Steve Carrell as obnoxious Michael Scott. Of course, I know people that absolutely refuse to watch the show because of the fact that Michael is so obnoxious. I'm just not one of them. Sure he's obnoxious, but there are other things about the show that keep me interested and first and foremost is Jim & Pam, which brings me to what you said about about there being no one to like on the show. I absolutely disagree with this, because IMO, the characters of Jim & Pam are very likable (or as someone else here said ... two of the most likeable characters on television ... or something to that effect).
Also, Til Death and Back to You get much lower ratings then The Office, yet those shows arent labeled as "they are not mass appeal hits and never will be."
That's because both those shows suck to hell. It would only be noteworthy if they got GOOD ratings. The failure of mediocrity need never be explained. Whether one is talking about Back to You or Eli Stone.
Originally posted by RoyBoyCF: Apparently, if a large percentage of a show's audience is in the 18-49 demo, it's a hit. Which makes sense since it's young people writing and reading major media outlets.
The problem with the word "hit" is that it's totally vague, ambiguous, and subjective.
To some it means giant viewer numbers, in relation to other shows on tv.
To some it means that it gets good demo numbers vs. it's competition.
To some it means having a mix of fairly strong ratings and a good amount of press buzz.
To some it means critical acclaim.
To some it means the amount of ad revenue the show gets.
To some it is a mix of pop culture appeal, ratings, dvd sales, their personal opinion, etc, etc, etc,
!!!!
This was probably one of the biggest irks that i have had, was that when i joined this forum, i kept reading that The Office was not a hit.
In my mind, i thought that a) the office brings in a lot of money for NBC, and can get better ad rates than most shows on tv, b)the demo numbers were very good vs. other shows, c) the word-of-mouth, critical acclaim, dvd sales, online viral presence, and press buzz were all very impressive.
To me, this was MORE than enough to call The Office a hit, yet, to some, simply because of one factor, total viewership, they could not bring themselves to call the office a hit.
The problem is that a "hit" means too many things to too many people. And unfortunately no one is really "right."
You simply MUST define context before talking about a show's "hit" status or not.
The Office gets very good ratings--but it's on a night, and a network, that in the past has seen equally edgy unconventional sitcoms produce huge ratings. It's been around a while, it's had plenty of time to be discovered, it's got awards and critical raves, and it's judged against that past standard of success. You can say it's unfair, but what's fairness got to do with anything?
In some ways I like it better than Seinfeld, but it's no Seinfeld, and it probably won't hold up as well as Seinfeld did, over time. I don't care. I'm enjoying it now. And I don't care who thinks it's a hit. What's so great about watching a hit? Anybody can do that. Anybody does, or it wouldn't be called a hit.
Originally posted by dumont: If I had to rank-order the six ABC 10 pm series still sitting on the bubble from best to worst prospects for another season, here's how I figure them as of this morning:
1. Boston Legal 2. Eli Stone 3. Men in Trees 4. Womens Murder Club 5. Big Shots 6. October Road
But hasn't "Big Shots" been cancelled?? I don't know that "October Road" has any chance of coming back (darnit, I'm one of the few that actually liked the show), but atleast it hasn't officially been cancelled ... yet (and hopefully it won't, but I won't hold my breath).
Originally posted by RoyBoyCF: Apparently, if a large percentage of a show's audience is in the 18-49 demo, it's a hit. Which makes sense since it's young people writing and reading major media outlets.
The problem with the word "hit" is that it's totally vague, ambiguous, and subjective.
To some it means giant viewer numbers, in relation to other shows on tv.
To some it means that it gets good demo numbers vs. it's competition.
To some it means having a mix of fairly strong ratings and a good amount of press buzz.
To some it means critical acclaim.
To some it means the amount of ad revenue the show gets.
To some it is a mix of pop culture appeal, ratings, dvd sales, their personal opinion, etc, etc, etc,
!!!!
This was probably one of the biggest irks that i have had, was that when i joined this forum, i kept reading that The Office was not a hit.
In my mind, i thought that a) the office brings in a lot of money for NBC, and can get better ad rates than most shows on tv, b)the demo numbers were very good vs. other shows, c) the word-of-mouth, critical acclaim, dvd sales, online viral presence, and press buzz were all very impressive.
To me, this was MORE than enough to call The Office a hit, yet, to some, simply because of one factor, total viewership, they could not bring themselves to call the office a hit.
The problem is that a "hit" means too many things to too many people. And unfortunately no one is really "right."
You simply MUST define context before talking about a show's "hit" status or not.
Personally, a hit show is a show that is a combination the most elements you mentioned in your post (high viewers, high demo, ad rates, dvd sales, inernational succes, .... And for me "The Office" is a NOT hit compared to DH, Grey's, Lost, AI, ....
Originally posted by dumont: While I do think ABC will ultimately bring Eli Stone back, at least for another limited run, the executive suite at the Alphabet sure has its work cut out for it on deciding which 10 pm hour-longs to keep vs. toss. Indications are that ABC wants to keep two and jettison the rest.
If I had to rank-order the six ABC 10 pm series still sitting on the bubble from best to worst prospects for another season, here's how I figure them as of this morning:
1. Boston Legal 2. Eli Stone 3. Men in Trees 4. Womens Murder Club 5. Big Shots 6. October Road
If Women's Murder Club does well on Tuesdays, it will go up and probably cinch renewal. If Boston Legal dies on Wednesdays, it may jeopardize its renewal decision.
And Men in Trees needs one miracle rating next Wednesday to push it up the list, or convert ABC decision-makers into buying into a third season.
October Road and Big Shots are long shots at best, but both could be shocker renewals (vs. Eli Stone, Big Shots did pretty decent numbers, especially W18-34, at 10 pm on Thursdays).
Since Big Shots had new episodes of Grey's Anatomy as a leadin, it's not a big surprise it did well with W18-34 vrs Eli Stone which had LOST, a more male demo show, as lead-in. I think if GA aired prior to ES it would have done well in the women demos as well.
But in the end, I think only two of the three shows (ES, BL, WMC)will make it back. The others are done and I don't see MIT suddenly gaining viewers in it's final pre-upfront airing. If Eli Stone does come back, ABC probably will hold it back for late-fall or mid-season as they did with October Road.
Originally posted by whatsonpop: It should be interesting to see what type of effect the post-Super Bowl airing of the Office has on its long-term ratings.
I agree. But I think it'll make The Office huge. I'm hoping for at least 13-14 million viewers as an episode average, after the Superbowl. I think at least 26 mil people will tune into after the Superbowl.
But in the end, I think only two of the three shows (ES, BL, WMC)will make it back. The others are done and I don't see MIT suddenly gaining viewers in it's final pre-upfront airing. If Eli Stone does come back, ABC probably will hold it back for late-fall or mid-season as they did with October Road.
And then put it out of its misery, as they are about to do for October Road.
Uh, my "WHAT was not about what is and isn't a hit, but directed to RoyBoyCF's statement about "young people" and media outlets.
quote:
Originally posted by the128boy:
quote:
Originally posted by TV-aholic: What ?????
quote:
Originally posted by RoyBoyCF: Apparently, if a large percentage of a show's audience is in the 18-49 demo, it's a hit. Which makes sense since it's young people writing and reading major media outlets.
The problem with the word "hit" is that it's totally vague, ambiguous, and subjective.
To some it means giant viewer numbers, in relation to other shows on tv.
To some it means that it gets good demo numbers vs. it's competition.
To some it means having a mix of fairly strong ratings and a good amount of press buzz.
To some it means critical acclaim.
To some it means the amount of ad revenue the show gets.
To some it is a mix of pop culture appeal, ratings, dvd sales, their personal opinion, etc, etc, etc,
!!!!
This was probably one of the biggest irks that i have had, was that when i joined this forum, i kept reading that The Office was not a hit.
In my mind, i thought that a) the office brings in a lot of money for NBC, and can get better ad rates than most shows on tv, b)the demo numbers were very good vs. other shows, c) the word-of-mouth, critical acclaim, dvd sales, online viral presence, and press buzz were all very impressive.
To me, this was MORE than enough to call The Office a hit, yet, to some, simply because of one factor, total viewership, they could not bring themselves to call the office a hit.
The problem is that a "hit" means too many things to too many people. And unfortunately no one is really "right."
You simply MUST define context before talking about a show's "hit" status or not.
But after watching, and loving, last week’s dinner party themed episode, the problem with last night is why the show itself is not a mass appeal hit. There is no one to like on The Office. Steve Carell as Michael is completely obnoxious and the employees of Dunder Mifflin leave very little to be desired. Then again, can you really blame them while working in an environment like that?
I don't think that's enough of an explanation. We have embraced unlikeable protagonists in the past--Michael is certainly no more obnoxiously self-involved than George Costanza (though George was perhaps a tad more self-aware). And Pam and Jim are extremely likeable--that is, in fact, their function on the show. They watch their co-workers with the same bewildered amusement as the audience. Our stand-ins. And it works. But it doesn't make The Office a big hit--just a solid success.
Serialized storylines. A large cast of characters, many of whom are physically unattractive (translation: normal-looking) in a way that American TV audiences have become unused to. And a criminally weak Thursday slate to support it. A network that doesn't know how to sell the show, and doesn't have the right shows to put alongside it. That, to me, explains it better. I actually do like most of the characters. But yeah, some people would find it all too abrasive and offputting. 75% fewer people (in the demo) than find that to be true of 30 Rock. Damned if I'm going to watch unlikeable people who don't make me laugh.
I also think the Office is hurt by the fact that you have to work in an office to appreciate a lot of the humor (or at least it helps). Someone who works construction, for example, might not be able to relate to the show as much as someone who works in an office.
To me, this was MORE than enough to call The Office a hit, yet, to some, simply because of one factor, total viewership, they could not bring themselves to call the office a hit.
You have to admit that that's a pretty big factor though, especially in a forum based on the Nielsen ratings.
