Originally posted by tvfan300: Big Brother performed respectably in a timeslot opposite the TV ratings monster and another reality show, The Biggest Loser. I'm actually a bit surprised at how well it did.
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Originally posted by Pam:
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Originally posted by lopez: Why Big Brother is not a loser?
THIRD in viewers THIRD in the demo
I agree .. With all the promotions CBS does for this show it got bad ratings . The Unit did much better against AI compared to BB !! What is CBS thinking ?
Don't try and reason with Pam, she won't here anything bad about one of the "classics",The Unit.
Reason with me ? For what ? Speaking the truth based on facts.. The Unit did much better than BB did . Nothing to argue or debate. The Unit unlike himym is a quality series and CBS is showing its usual Crappy Broadcasting Station mumbo-jumbo and then wonders why it loses viewers to FOX LOL !!
Actually, the Unit probably would've lost the valuable demo viewers at 9pm where Big Brother actually grew by a considerable amount. Did it lose viewers? Yes. Was it better than what the Unit repeats would've pulled? Yes. Should the Unit return later this year? Probably, but think of this as an opportunity to end up with more episodes next year.
Originally posted by Mredman: Ok i am going to come up with a good excuse why Jericho didn't do so well in the ratings BB is a bad lead-in. Horrible numbers and it is a realty show it has nothing in common with it this drivel
Sorry not legitimate.. Whether bad lead in or not CBS hyped this show's return via promos, advertisements, and website and everyone knew Jericho was going to return and when too .. Jericho was struggling before and still is !!
Well in terms of retention out of lead in, Jericho did alright. Was Big Brother really a compatible lead in? Probably not. Is this timeslot still better than Wed. at 8 for it? IMO, yes. Did Jericho most likely just lose audience last year despite the storyline actually getting better as time went on? Yes. Agreed that CBS has given the show a chance. Lets see if it perks up if Big Brother does here in the coming weeks (which I think it will).
Originally posted by Pam: No surprise Jericho did not do well and it was expected .. My biggest surprise was CBS decision to still allow Big Brother since it got lower ratings and demos than The Unit and yet is much more hyped not only in media but on their website .
There is quality programming ie The Unit and the crud like Big Brother but CBS would have have the crud show on its schedule .. You gotta love networking choices *rolleyes* and now know why more and more are tuning out not tuning in ..
They didn't just decide to replace The Unit with BB, The Unit ran out of episodes because of the strike. And they aren't keeping it to slight The Unit. They're keeping it on because it will be over a month before any of the dramas come back.
If that is the case why hasn't CBS asked for new episodes of The Unit like it has other dramas ? Seems suspicious to me !
Maybe because what I've been saying all along is inching closer to becoming true: the Unit is dead meat here in the next year or so. The show's demos quite frankly stink for a show with so many viewers and Les Moonves is youth nuts. For instance if Boston Legal aired on CBS, it would've been cancelled last year. Now, I do think the Unit will be renewed this year and if Big Brother dips any more will likely return this year with Big Brother getting either moved to another night or shortened. However, BB is likely to only increase in audience in the coming weeks as drama unfolds.
Originally posted by Pam: Sorry for disrecting anyone watching BB .. I guess I am really shocked CBS did not request new episodes of The Unit but that is no reason to get down on BB.. I do not watch it as it doesn't look good to me but I'm not into reality shows !!
I don't like reality shows either, and if CBS decided to drop The Unit and air BB in a non-strike situation, I would agree with you.
I actually think CBS wants the younger Big Brother to remain the lead in for now. BB will likely increase in audience in the coming weeks (no Death Star and more drama in the show itself). I also think Tuesday at 10pm will become Swingtown's timeslot here in April. If not, then I don't know why BB couldn't be moved to 10pm and the Unit relaunched in April at 9pm.
Originally posted by AmericanGothic: I think one of the many problems with The CW is that they are very selective with what shows they want to succeed. They could've done better with handling shows such as: Life Is Wild, Hidden Palms.
In the case of Hidden Palms, I think they paid for a product, then realized that it was total garbage when it arrived. All the other networks will hold off a show like that for summer burnoff as well. Life is Wild is a bit different because, at least on paper, it looked like it would be a show with broad range appeal and a fascination 'on location' angle. Unfortunately, what showed up was just another family/teen soap and for whatever reason (I won't speculate on at the moment), the fans of the last family soap in that timeslot were unwilling to try the new show. It is unfortunate that the 7th Heaven fans rejected Life is Wild, but people thinking that the show would have suceeded if it had simply been moved to another night and advertised more are kidding themselves. The CW did have a 'here it is. Now, it is up to you to keep it on the air' attitude for the show. It was an experimental type show due to the setting and if the 'word of mouth' wasn't going to get people to watch it, nothing would. Jericho is getting the same attitude from CBS right now. The fans were told to make it popular or this would be the end. If the 'core fanbase' won't watch the show and pursuade their friends/family/neighbors/etc... to watch it, then it won't survive.
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It's probably the reason she never made UPN successful
Despite the propaganda on this messageboard, UPN was every bit as successful as WB.
Why do you insist its 7th Heaven fans that abandoned Life is Wild? The show didn't have a shot in hell. Even 7th Heaven was dipping to series lows on Sundays towards the end and failing to hit 3 million viewers. Life is Wild had an average lead in of about 800,000 viewers. No show should be expected to survive in that situation. 7th Heaven fans shouldn't have been expected to watch the show. For one, it got about 1/4 the promotion of the other new CW shows and two, many 7th Heaven fans were done with the CW before 7th Heaven even ended. The crappy treatment to the CW Sunday shows has been going on since it became a network 18 months ago. As for UPN not being as successful as the WB, I agree that it was in terms of viewership, but in terms of marketing, promotion, and identity, the WB was far ahead until the final two seasons when they were both a bit more evened out. Not to mention, the WB actually had years where they made small profits. However, the merger made it clear both were on the decline in the long run.
Maybe because what I've been saying all along is inching closer to becoming true: the Unit is dead meat here in the next year or so. The show's demos quite frankly stink for a show with so many viewers and Les Moonves is youth nuts.
I agree. The Unit performs relatively poorly among adults 18-34, IIRC, and just OK among adults 18-49. Big Brother historically does well among adults 18-34 (although I have no idea why -- I find it boring and annoying). Advertisers will pay big premiums to reach that audience.
Posts: 89 | Location: Newark/NYC | Registered: 16 November 2006
One of the reason BL is not been renewed yet (the numers are bad, but I think with the strike and a damaged pilot season, and ABC ratings, they would have done at least another season) is that Spader, Shatner and Bergen all three have to renegotiate their contracts. With these not impressive ratings for the second part of the season, if they ask too much, the series is gone.
And in the end the love you take is equal to the love you make.
If you find my english is bad, it's because I'm italian. :-)
Posts: 78 | Location: Italy | Registered: 15 May 2007
Originally posted by mushu_jj: Why do you insist its 7th Heaven fans that abandoned Life is Wild?
The family soap fans were tuning in to the TV in that timeslot on that channel the yeasr before. It was the very best spot CW could give for a similar show. The fact that virtually no one that was watching the year before returned is well documented.
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Life is Wild had an average lead in of about 800,000 viewers. No show should be expected to survive in that situation.
I think it unfair to portray the 8pm show as needing lead-in on Sunday when the 8pm shows have no such designation on the other 6 days of the week.
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7th Heaven fans shouldn't have been expected to watch the show.
If the CW couldn't 'expect' 7th Heaven fans to watch Life is Wild, who could they expect to watch Life is Wild?
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many 7th Heaven fans were done with the CW before 7th Heaven even ended.
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As for UPN not being as successful as the WB, I agree that it was in terms of viewership, but in terms of marketing, promotion, and identity, the WB was far ahead until the final two seasons when they were both a bit more evened out.
A silly distinction. What you have now claimed is that UPN was just as successful in drawing viewers even though they had no plan to draw viewers. If anything, that makes WB's failure all the more glaring.
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Not to mention, the WB actually had years where they made small profits.
The WB moved into a very small profit right at the end by stopping virtually all new product development, squeezing budgets for their current shows downward, and destroying the network. That is definitely not a 'profit model' anyone would want to follow since it was very short terms and suicidal for the network.
I wanted to say that I am not American, but that the shows of The CW like OTH, SN, Smallville are highly popular and loved here in Europe. So it's absolutely not true that they have bad show. I know tha many of these that I have mentioned were of the WB, but that does not take away the merit at The CW to have brought forward. Despite the low ratings, also GG is becoming a very popular show. In all the world we have big and medium networks, but this does not mean that they can't do important things. Take a show like The OC on the FOX that in his 1 season had 9-8 milion of viewers and that is lasted only 4 seasons. This show had a huge potential, could really be the heir of 90210 but Fox has not been able to maintain high levels. All doing mistakes, even the big networks. Once again, The CW probably did not have great ratings, but certainly can gain much from these shows in different ways.
Sorry for the bad english, I hope that you understand me.
LOST - will not be threatened by WAT at 10pm more like other way around
JERICHO - ep was less than compelling
BOSTON LEGAL - premature to call for cancellation
Post GA/LOST jinx - doesn't exist, make better shows.
SHAUN CASSIDY - unforgiveable cliffhangers on INVASION and THE AGENCY.
UGLY BETTY - don't move it.
100% agree
Ditto, except for UB -- I think if it keeps losing ground to Survivor and 5th grader, they'll have to move it to another night to keep Thursday tops -- but only if they find the right replacement first. I think once they have successfully found a good 10pm post-Grey's show, they can worry about moving UB, otherwise they'll create too many holes around Grey's.
And I still think Cassity Invasion would be great as a 3-day miniseries to conclude its storyline. That way, they don't have to worry about actors committed to other shows, they can shoot over the summer or another break. I can't believe that show failed, it had an awesome premise, great acting, and should have fit well with LOST.
And I still think Cassity Invasion would be great as a 3-day miniseries to conclude its storyline. That way, they don't have to worry about actors committed to other shows, they can shoot over the summer or another break. I can't believe that show failed, it had an awesome premise, great acting, and should have fit well with LOST.
There was some confusion as to whether they should try to delay the revelation that yes, in fact, there were aliens in our midst, or keep playing it coy for as long as possible (maybe it's just Post Traumatic Stress). People got impatient and tuned out.
The network (if I recall correctly) wanted the revelation delayed, because they wanted Invasion to be like Lost, which always hedges its bets, and never quite commits to saying "yes, weird stuff that can't be fully explained by present-day science is really truly happening", even though that clearly is the case. Cassidy didn't think that was sustainable for Invasion, but the network was signing the checks. But in any event, it worked out pretty well, creatively speaking--they had enough time to develop the idea, and put the characters through a few changes (in more ways than one), and I'm not sure there was any point in going on, even if the ratings had been great. It became a defacto season-long miniseries with a chilling finale--and no final resolution, but so what?
It really was not the kind of show that tends to become a hit, but it was fun while it lasted. I'm not sure I'd have liked the ending, if it had ever come--how do you write a conclusion, when it's really a statement on things happening in our society right now that haven't been resolved yet? Best to leave it unresolved. Anyway, that's how it will remain. I mean, was there ever a finale miniseres for American Gothic?
Never watch a Shaun Cassidy show expecting a long-running perfectly resolved story (geez, never watch network television expecting that). Just appreciate all the interesting ideas, unconventional casting, and just flat-out weirdness of the proceedings. He may never come up with the recipe for a sustained success, but he sure does know how to stir the pot.
And I still think Cassity Invasion would be great as a 3-day miniseries to conclude its storyline. That way, they don't have to worry about actors committed to other shows, they can shoot over the summer or another break. I can't believe that show failed, it had an awesome premise, great acting, and should have fit well with LOST.
There was some confusion as to whether they should try to delay the revelation that yes, in fact, there were aliens in our midst, or keep playing it coy for as long as possible (maybe it's just Post Traumatic Stress). People got impatient and tuned out.
The network (if I recall correctly) wanted the revelation delayed, because they wanted Invasion to be like Lost, which always hedges its bets, and never quite commits to saying "yes, weird stuff that can't be fully explained by present-day science is really truly happening", even though that clearly is the case. Cassidy didn't think that was sustainable for Invasion, but the network was signing the checks. But in any event, it worked out pretty well, creatively speaking--they had enough time to develop the idea, and put the characters through a few changes (in more ways than one), and I'm not sure there was any point in going on, even if the ratings had been great. It became a defacto season-long miniseries with a chilling finale--and no final resolution, but so what?
It really was not the kind of show that tends to become a hit, but it was fun while it lasted. I'm not sure I'd have liked the ending, if it had ever come--how do you write a conclusion, when it's really a statement on things happening in our society right now that haven't been resolved yet? Best to leave it unresolved. Anyway, that's how it will remain. I mean, was there ever a finale miniseres for American Gothic?
Never watch a Shaun Cassidy show expecting a long-running perfectly resolved story (geez, never watch network television expecting that). Just appreciate all the interesting ideas, unconventional casting, and just flat-out weirdness of the proceedings. He may never come up with the recipe for a sustained success, but he sure does know how to stir the pot.
All good points. ABC had considered miniseries resolutions for both Invasion and Commander-in-chief, its two breakout "hits" that season that both fizzled in the end (in the case of the former, definitely due to ABC's misteps and misscheduling). Even with all your points accounted for, I think a 3-day miniseries (ala Stephen King's The Stand) would be good tv, and I think many sci-fi fans would commit to it, knowing there'd be some kind of resolution.
Originally posted by mushu_jj: Why do you insist its 7th Heaven fans that abandoned Life is Wild?
The family soap fans were tuning in to the TV in that timeslot on that channel the yeasr before. It was the very best spot CW could give for a similar show. The fact that virtually no one that was watching the year before returned is well documented.
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Life is Wild had an average lead in of about 800,000 viewers. No show should be expected to survive in that situation.
I think it unfair to portray the 8pm show as needing lead-in on Sunday when the 8pm shows have no such designation on the other 6 days of the week.
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7th Heaven fans shouldn't have been expected to watch the show.
If the CW couldn't 'expect' 7th Heaven fans to watch Life is Wild, who could they expect to watch Life is Wild?
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many 7th Heaven fans were done with the CW before 7th Heaven even ended.
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As for UPN not being as successful as the WB, I agree that it was in terms of viewership, but in terms of marketing, promotion, and identity, the WB was far ahead until the final two seasons when they were both a bit more evened out.
A silly distinction. What you have now claimed is that UPN was just as successful in drawing viewers even though they had no plan to draw viewers. If anything, that makes WB's failure all the more glaring.
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Not to mention, the WB actually had years where they made small profits.
The WB moved into a very small profit right at the end by stopping virtually all new product development, squeezing budgets for their current shows downward, and destroying the network. That is definitely not a 'profit model' anyone would want to follow since it was very short terms and suicidal for the network.
Well unless you may have forgotten, 7th Heaven only aired on Sundays in its final season so this whole nonsense of it being an established timeslot is ridiculous, especially when you consider how viewership fell. If the 8pm hour is not dependent on the lead in then why not move an established show there and why did the comedies fail there the first time around? As for Life is Wild, I can about guarantee you the repeats of sitcoms that most CW stations play in the 7pm hour during the week bring in more than 800,000 viewers combined at any given time so yes, the lead in still sucks the big one. Not to mention there was nothing airing behind it worth watching so none of the pre-tune in factor happened either. You can't honestly tell me that Life is Wild would've done as badly had it aired on just about any other night of the week. The network was just throwing it to the dogs to attempt to please viewers of family friendly programming. To bad for them people were already going after that on ABC Family and other networks. I agree with you that cutting costs is not a way to make money but I'm pretty sure the WB's glory years ended up being profitable for them as well. It was just that the years that followed relied to much on dying older programs and the network failed to fine new hits in the quantity they had before. UPN was successful in bringing in viewers as a whole, but many of the years it was on the air it had absolutely no flow to its lineup. For the majority of its run, it was minority comedies on Monday, low rated junk on Tuesday, Star Trek and the usual flop behind Star Trek on Wednesdays, Wrestling on Thursdays, and movies on Fridays. It was a jumbled mess. The WB at least had some flow. Did both eventually suffer the same fate? Yes.
