quote: cbs: pretty much everything, but very low demo numbers for some reason
Define "Very Low Demo Numbers"
I thought CBS was currently #2 in the demo.
Didn't CBS finsh #2 in the demo last season... and ahead of ABC?
I meant low for their huge viewer numbers, I mean have you seen the demo and viewer numbers for NCIS (there are many other examples)
and do you know who won the november sweeps in demo? its abc btw just so you know
ABC didn't win sweeps on the strength of it's regular series, it won based on it's specials. Do you honestly think that it would have won without Charlie Brown, Shrek, and the CMAs? I'm not saying that they should use the specials, but their sweeps average doesn't say all that much about their regular programming.
shows that have dropped alot since their premiere:
cbs3 out of 4 new shows)
1.Cane 2.Kid Nation 3.Moonlight
Actually, I've talked about how much Cane has dropped (4 million). It should have been a great show. The cast was phenomenal, but the writing was horrid.
While neither Kid Nation nor Moonlight have done great in their numbers, they haven't lost nearly as many viewers as most the new ABC shows. Kid Nation lost 2 million from premiere to finale (and only 200 thousand from the second airing). Moonlight has lost only 1 million viewers from premier to last new episode.
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nbc4 out of 4 new shows)
1.life 2.chuck 3.journeyman 4.BW
I'll definitely give you BW (8 million) and Journeyman (5 million). The shows hemorrhaged viewers at an alarming rate. Life lost 2.5 million. I'm not saying that's good, but it was actually gaining viewers back, which might be reason to renew it...we'll see. You are completely off about Chuck though. It lost less than 1 million viewers from premiere to finale.
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fox3 out of 5 new shows, other 2 cancelled from the start)
1.k-ville 2.KN 3.B2Y
K-ville lost 3 million viewers and was canceled. Kitchen Nightmares lost less than 1 million (how is that dropping "a lot"?). Back 2 You lost 2 million, but actually stayed quite steady after the initial post-premiere drop.
On the other hand, DSM lost 4 million, as did Carpoolers, Cavemen, and even Private Practice (which I think is still doing well anyway, so long as it can keep over 10). Pushing Daisies has lost more than 6 million since the premiere, as did Big Shots. Samantha Who? lost an alarming 8 million from the premiere to the last episode (3 million of that in one week). Women's Murder Club is the only new ABC show that has lost less than 3 million since it's premiere.
The only shows that have dropped more than ABC's "hits" are BW, Journeyman, and Cane (no one is talking about them anymore because it's a foregone conclusion that they'll be canceled). So no, I don't think I'm being unfair talking about DSM's 4 million viewer drop but not Chuck's 800 thousand viewer drop.
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I don't think ABC is going suddenly going to collapse, but I do think they are overly dependent on DWTS and a couple of well-performing shows that repeat poorly.
so abc's shows arent good for the strike, does that make the network worthless? the strike will not last forever, and when it ends, abc will be a top performer, and they have a really good strike schedule
I never said ABC was worthless. But, ABC will only be a top performer after the strike if it can find some new shows (or if Cashmere Mafia and Eli Stone turn into surprise hits). They cannot be a top network with their shows performing like October Road, MiT, and DSM have been.
ABC didn't win sweeps on the strength of it's regular series, it won based on it's specials. Do you honestly think that it would have won without Charlie Brown, Shrek, and the CMAs? I'm not saying that they should use the specials, but their sweeps average doesn't say all that much about their regular programming.
Do you see what actually airs on other networks, or do you only concentrate on what airs on abc so you can criticize it, all of fox, cbs and nbc have aired many football matches(and you cant call sports "regular programming"), cbs uses it to strengthen its sunday lineup, nbc has a full night full of football on sunday, and fox for the most part airs many football matches, not to mention various award shows and holiday specials that aired on other networks, so there isnt an excuse there
For a show to claim it has 'over 10 million viewers, average', it has to average that for first run and repeats, IMO. So, you can scratch Lost, Private Practice, Brothers& Sisters, Ugly Betty, and Boston Legal (which shouldn't be listed even in first runs) from the list.
WHAT? did you come up with that rule? I was talking about first run episodes, who counts repeats? I mean I know you dont like abc, but to spin it like that is just stuped(no offence)
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If you would've been fair you would've made a list also for CBS shows over 10 million. This way it seems ABC is leading the field.
I thought I was being fair when I said "pretty much everything, but very low demo numbers for some reason"
They cannot be a top network with their shows performing like October Road, MiT, and DSM have been.
so I have mentioned atleast 10 shows of abc which perform over 10 million and you think it cant be a top network because of those 3 shows, all the other networks have weak offerings, and why cant you say that about the other networks?
we saw this week that all of cbs's repeat shows are doing badly in repeats except on thursdays, and they have almost no new programming so they will depend on big brother, a show that already doesnt do very well in the summer, you think now it will become a surprise hit in regular tv season, what about fox, sure it has AI, but I have watched almost all of their pilots for this season, and all of their new shows are really bad(except sarah connor), can it really be the top performer without AI
abc has for this strike season:
1.DWTS(3 hours) 2.lost 3.EMHE 4.Oprah big give 5.wife swap 6.supernanny
they also have eli stone, cashmere mafia and dance wars, they cant all fail
ABC didn't win sweeps on the strength of it's regular series, it won based on it's specials. Do you honestly think that it would have won without Charlie Brown, Shrek, and the CMAs? I'm not saying that they should use the specials, but their sweeps average doesn't say all that much about their regular programming.
Do you see what actually airs on other networks, or do you only concentrate on what airs on abc so you can criticize it, all of fox, cbs and nbc have aired many football matches(and you cant call sports "regular programming"), cbs uses it to strengthen its sunday lineup, nbc has a full night full of football on sunday, and fox for the most part airs many football matches, not to mention various award shows and holiday specials that aired on other networks, so there isnt an excuse there
NBC has Sunday night football on their regular schedule (as issued at the beginning of the season) for every week, so yes, I would consider that regular programing for them. I'll grant you CBS's football overrun on Sundays as not regular, but they only had football overrun once during sweeps and that overrun hurts the Sunday shows as much or more than it helps them. A show dropping from 14 million to 12 million when there is an overrun is hardly being "strengthened." Fox's overrun is also "special," but Fox was in last place (of the major 4), so the fact that ABC could have beat them without the specials isn't exactly something to write home about.
CBS, FOX, and NBC had no Christmas specials, movies, or award shows during sweeps.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: Holly,
but they only had football overrun once during sweeps and that overrun hurts the Sunday shows as much or more than it helps them. A show dropping from 14 million to 12 million when there is an overrun is hardly being "strengthened."
but the 3 hours of primetime counted during sweeps were very high, and that was their aim, anyways I mean have you seen the rating of cbs's sunday shows without a good football match?
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CBS, FOX, and NBC had no no Christmas specials, movies, or award shows during sweeps.
actually you are wrong, cbs had the following specials:
1.MY NIGHT AT THE GRAMMYS 2.CSI/WAT crossover (and dont you tell me this is not a special event, because I am sure you can convince us that the crossover between csi and WAT is nothing out of the ordinary and happens all the time) 3.football overrun on sundays
NBC:
1.Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade 2.National Purina Dog Show 3.The Incredibles 4.Christmas in Rockefeller Center(not in dec, but in nov 28)
For a show to claim it has 'over 10 million viewers, average', it has to average that for first run and repeats
WHAT? did you come up with that rule? I was talking about first run episodes, who counts repeats? I mean I know you dont like abc, but to spin it like that is just stuped(no offence)
None taken. You just gave me the biggest laugh of the day by calling me stupid while spelling it wrong.
The reason most people are criticizing ABC is because of their poor repeat performances. If their shows didn't repeat so much more poorly that CBS shows, for example, I don't think many people would be predicting such a dire future for ABC as the strike continues. Your contention that repeats don't matter is silly. The contention that shows like Boston Legal and Ugly Betty qualify as 10million viewer shows simply because they sometimes reach that level is a stretch.
Originally posted by Holly: NBC has Sunday night football on their regular schedule (as issued at the beginning of the season) for every week, so yes, I would consider that regular programing for them.
I agree. It would be illogical to claim that Sunday Night Football doesn't count as a 'regular program' when it airs all fall long just like the reality shows and eats up a big chunk of NBC's budget.
On the other hand, the special football airing CBS and NBC just got from the NFL network was certainly not a 'regular' program. Would NBC have come out on top last week without lucking into that bonus broadcast?
You just gave me the biggest laugh of the day by calling me stupid while spelling it wrong.
you know what else I find that is stupid(this time its right) and immature, is when someone calls me for my spelling especially since a lot of people type really fast, and dont check every letter they have written, so someone like you doesnt have nothing to critisize about me, so you go right to my spelling, that is just lame, it reminds me of how people used to make fun of each other in the 5th grade (no offense )
oh and btw, if that is your biggest laugh of the day, then get a life (again no offense )
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The reason most people are criticizing ABC is because of their poor repeat performances.
almost all networks repeats poorly, nbc and fox also repeat very badly, and people are giving much undeserved credit to cbs's "repeat power", I have only seen good repeat ratings so far on thursday
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If their shows didn't repeat so much more poorly that CBS shows, for example, I don't think many people would be predicting such a dire future for ABC as the strike continues.
please, just days ago on the wednesday thread, people were predicting a dire future for cbs if the strike continues, just because their rating were in the bottom of the barrel on that day, its like the anti cbs people start dissing cbs when cbs has a bad day, and vice versa
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Your contention that repeats don't matter is silly.
Repeats actually dont matter as much as you think they do, if a show had excellent ratings in its first run episodes, but mediocre ratings in repeats, that doesnt make it any less successfull
CBS, FOX, and NBC had no no Christmas specials, movies, or award shows during sweeps.
actually you are wrong, cbs had the following specials:
1.MY NIGHT AT THE GRAMMYS 2.CSI/WAT crossover (and dont you tell me this is not a special event, because I am sure you can convince us that the crossover between csi and WAT is nothing out of the ordinary and happens all the time) 3.football overrun on sundays
NBC:
1.Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade 2.National Purina Dog Show 3.The Incredibles 4.Christmas in Rockefeller Center(not in dec, but in nov 28)
fox: 1.Dodgeball 2.a lot of football
I messed up the week, so you are right on The Incredibles, as well as Family Man airing on NBC. My apologies for the error.
Was the parade aired in primetime? If not, it didn't count towards sweeps (well, it did, but not the figures we were talking about).
When was the dog show aired?
Sweeps ended Wednesday Nov. 28th, so the My Night at the Grammys, Christmas at Rockefeller Center, and Dodgeball were not aired during sweeps.
Since the crossover included two regularly scheduled shows in their regular time, I do not consider that to be special programming.
You just gave me the biggest laugh of the day by calling me stupid while spelling it wrong.
you know what else I find that is stupid(this time its right) and immature, is when someone calls me for my spelling especially since a lot of people type really fast, and dont check every letter they have written, so someone like you doesnt have nothing to critisize about me, so you go right to my spelling, that is just lame, it reminds me of how people used to make fun of each other in the 5th grade (no offense )
I wasn't critisizing your spelling. I was making an honest observation that your attempt at namecalling childishness resulted in an unintended funny for everyone else to read.
I could point out the oddity of your claim that I critisized your spelling because I couldn't find anything to criticize about you. Was I suppose to make a joke about your haircut or something? I would assume that you meant that I couldn't find anything to criticize about what you had to say, but since my response to you did address what you had to say (my contention that ABCs ratings matter in repeats as well as first runs), I am left with wondering what you were attempting to communicate above. Care to take a second try at it? Bonus points if you can do it without the namecalling that you started and that you are the only one to have done.
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almost all networks repeats poorly, nbc and fox also repeat very badly,
I disagree. I do not believe that FOX or NBC shows have the same dramatic dropoff between first run and repeat runs that ABC has for most of its shows.
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Repeats actually dont matter as much as you think they do, if a show had excellent ratings in its first run episodes, but mediocre ratings in repeats, that doesnt make it any less successfull
Advertisers pay for first run and for repeats. How can you possibly believe that the repeat performance does not matter to ABC's bottom line?
3 out of 4 new shows)
