Originally posted by SW: 30 Rock held 90% of its lead-in audience in 18-49.
Good point! That's often one of the biggest issues we talk about: the 18-49 demographic, especially in terms of audience held out of lead-in. 30 held onto a good chunk of the lead-in, and its ratings are up over last year, despite losses (they have gone down since the premier, which is to be expected, especially considering all the press at the beginning). 2 good things out of 3. That's not too bad, right? LOL. Just playing devil's advocate.
Posts: 302 | Location: Indiana | Registered: 29 January 2007
Originally posted by TV-aholic: SPIN?? Its is a fact that it has dropped each and every week.
In just its 3rd episode, its down over a million viewers and a half point in the demo since its season premiere.
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Originally posted by xwiseguyx: Amazing how people will throw in a negative spin on 30 Rock no matter how well it does.
I don't have an opinion of 30 Rock because I don't watch it, but I'd like to point something out: Most shows drop in the second week (and subsequent weeks, sometimes). The premier is usually the highest rating until sweeps. You know...the big ones. A million IS a lot to lose, even on a larger network (vs. CW), but the show IS up from last year. It's one of the few shows that are actually up, even if not by much. Supernatural and 30 Rock are two shows I can think of that are posting numbers significantly above numbers posted last season at this time (or any time, for that matter!).
So the point: Why is it that, when we talk about some shows, people whine that we're not taking everything into account, that we need to look at increases/decreases over previous years as well as the trends this year. There is a lot to consider, and I think it's crap that people only consider what makes their show(s) look good or only consider what makes a show look bad. Mark seems ambivalent toward 30 Rock, maybe even doesn't like it. Does that affect how he reports it? Maybe. Probably. There's bias for you! I guess you might also call it spin.
Am I wrong? Is it just coincidence?
And again, I don't watch 30 Rock, so this has nothing to do with my opinion of 30 Rock. ;-)
I don't mean to cause any trouble at all, by the way. What do YOU all think should be considered for looking at ratings and making judgments about shows? What's the REALITY?
You are causeing absolutely not trouble here. You make very good points.
Your question is a very good question. In todays DVR world, what should be relevant and what should not be? I don't think there is just one answer. I think you should look at a specific show and look at why it is doing what it is doing. IMO, you cant apply the samething to all shows.
Originally posted by PaulC: Whether you want to criticize or praise 30 Rock's performance (and there's evidence on either side of that tiresome debate), at least have your arguements make sense. To say that people are avoiding watching The Office because 30 Rock follows it makes zero sense. Thats a stretch even for Pisher.
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Originally posted by pisher:QUOTE]
Only because The Office is dropping too--and while there are a number of reasons for that, one of them is certainly that 30 Rock is dragging it down. It is the weakest link--but we're still a ways off from goodbye.
THANK you! I must agree with you on that point. Since when does the "lead-out" matter? We never talk about the lead-out! LOL. It's always about the lead-in. You put the stronger show at the front and let the rest fall. No matter what kind of CRAP follows the crap that is American Idol, for instance, it will do "well."
Posts: 302 | Location: Indiana | Registered: 29 January 2007
Is the stunt casting, etc. finally over so we can really see where 30 Rock is ? First Tina Fey doing Palin brings in the viewers, then Oprah, now Jennifer Aniston. Are we finally done with the extracurricular activity so we can see if this show can do anything in the future or not ?
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Originally posted by Sorcerer8605:
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Originally posted by SW: 30 Rock held 90% of its lead-in audience in 18-49.
Good point! That's often one of the biggest issues we talk about: the 18-49 demographic, especially in terms of audience held out of lead-in. 30 held onto a good chunk of the lead-in, and its ratings are up over last year, despite losses (they have gone down since the premier, which is to be expected, especially considering all the press at the beginning). 2 good things out of 3. That's not too bad, right? LOL. Just playing devil's advocate.
I agree. It's continuation will depend on how well it does through the year and also how well it does in comparison to other bubble shows WAT, CC and The Unit. Numbers was on that list but with its pickup in the ratings due to a much better lead in, it should be an easy pickup for next season. 11thH's fate also could be determined by how strong of a development slate CBS has for next year and how many of their high profile projects (Streets of San Francisco, Hawaii 5-0, Criminal Minds spinoff) actually goes to pilot.
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Originally posted by TV-aholic: I think 11H is a bubble show. the numbers aren't bad, but not good either, espcially following CSI.season pick up?
Really? I see it following the same trajectory as "Shark:" renewed, but banished from Thursdays in favor of something more promising.
I know CBS has a lot of shows that do over 10 million, but I'd have to think any show that does over 10 million, especially this year, is relatively safe.
For pretty much all of 2008, Tina Fey has been a highly visible figure, due to her regular appearances on SNL--first with "Bitch is the new black" then with her Palin impression. The election has been the single biggest thing on the country's mind. Fey also starred in a major motion picture, and 30 Rock got all kinds of awards (that it didn't deserve), and there was an American Express commercial, and endless magazine covers. FeyFeyFey.
Not begrudging her, she's talented and attractive, and not a reality show contestant. But her show sucks.
Point is, with all this endless hype, combined with NBC's own hype, and the guest stars, and the lead-in from NBC's most popular comedy, 30 Rock can't even hang onto all of its lead-in. There are no other comedies up against it. Greys and CSI are in decline, and it should be good counterprogramming at that hour. But it isn't. NBC is the weak sister of Thursdays--a night it used to own.
The Office is losing steam, but 30 Rock should be GAINING steam. It should be going up in the ratings, but after a rather unimpressive (and predictable) uptick, it's heading back down again.
Again, NBC's real problem on Thursday is that it doesn't have a solid compatible lineup of shows, the way it did back in the days of Must-See TV. People who are looking for something to watch between 8-10pm, but aren't already addicted to The Office, are much less likely to sample NBC's comedies in that time period, because of shows like Kath & Kim, My Name is Earl, and 30 Rock. NBC finally found a comedy that worked, but they couldn't give it any back-up, and the opportunity to build a strong Thursday night lineup around The Office has been thrown away.
In fact, when people do show up to sample 30 Rock out of curiosity, because of the endless Fey-hype, they find a show that turns them off NBC as a whole. An unfunny narcissistic look at how the network supposedly works (but of course, doesn't).
Seriously, with all the attention Fey got in the last few months alone, how on EARTH does 30 Rock get lower ratings than Big Bang Theory? No lead-in at all for that--of course, its lead-out is highly compatible. We've repeatedly agreed that BBT and HIMYM help each other--because they're both pretty good now, and they're both compatible. So it doesn't matter that none of the stars of these shows have been featured in newscast after newscast dealing with the story of a political candidate who somehow managed to be even more overhyped than Tina Fey.
Is the stunt casting, etc. finally over so we can really see where 30 Rock is ? First Tina Fey doing Palin brings in the viewers, then Oprah, now Jennifer Aniston. Are we finally done with the extracurricular activity so we can see if this show can do anything in the future or not ?
I'm rooting for them to hire Cirque de Soleil to be the guest star later this season.
Originally posted by pisher: People are just in denial about 30 Rock.
Here's the reality:
For pretty much all of 2008, Tina Fey has been a highly visible figure, due to her regular appearances on SNL--first with "Bitch is the new black" then with her Palin impression. The election has been the single biggest thing on the country's mind. Fey also starred in a major motion picture, and 30 Rock got all kinds of awards (that it didn't deserve), and there was an American Express commercial, and endless magazine covers. FeyFeyFey.
Not begrudging her, she's talented and attractive, and not a reality show contestant. But her show sucks.
Point is, with all this endless hype, combined with NBC's own hype, and the guest stars, and the lead-in from NBC's most popular comedy, 30 Rock can't even hang onto all of its lead-in. There are no other comedies up against it. Greys and CSI are in decline, and it should be good counterprogramming at that hour. But it isn't. NBC is the weak sister of Thursdays--a night it used to own.
The Office is losing steam, but 30 Rock should be GAINING steam. It should be going up in the ratings, but after a rather unimpressive (and predictable) uptick, it's heading back down again.
Again, NBC's real problem on Thursday is that it doesn't have a solid compatible lineup of shows, the way it did back in the days of Must-See TV. People who are looking for something to watch between 8-10pm, but aren't already addicted to The Office, are much less likely to sample NBC's comedies in that time period, because of shows like Kath & Kim, My Name is Earl, and 30 Rock. NBC finally found a comedy that worked, but they couldn't give it any back-up, and the opportunity to build a strong Thursday night lineup around The Office has been thrown away.
In fact, when people do show up to sample 30 Rock out of curiosity, because of the endless Fey-hype, they find a show that turns them off NBC as a whole. An unfunny narcissistic look at how the network supposedly works (but of course, doesn't).
Seriously, with all the attention Fey got in the last few months alone, how on EARTH does 30 Rock get lower ratings than Big Bang Theory? No lead-in at all for that--of course, its lead-out is highly compatible. We've repeatedly agreed that BBT and HIMYM help each other--because they're both pretty good now, and they're both compatible. So it doesn't matter that none of the stars of these shows have been featured in newscast after newscast dealing with the story of a political candidate who somehow managed to be even more overhyped than Tina Fey.
No one could have expected 30 Rock to deliver higher ratings than the Office. 30 Rock was getting in the 5 million range last spring, and now, even after declining for 2 weeks had over 7.5 million last night.
And stop with this compatible lineup crap. How was the "Must See TV" days compatible? They had a smash hit at 8, everyone tuned out at 8:30, a smash hit at 9 and everyone tuned out at 9:30, and then a smash hit at 10. You call that compatible?
Oh yes, I am sure that people who have watched 30 Rock and have not liked it have decided that they won't watch any other NBC show. That makes a lot of sense.
No one could have expected 30 Rock to deliver higher ratings than the Office.
But if it had, you'd be screaming "I KNEW IT!! I KNEW IT!!!"
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30 Rock was getting in the 5 million range last spring, and now, even after declining for 2 weeks had over 7.5 million last night.
So if it goes down to 5mil again, they can cancel it?
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And stop with this compatible lineup crap.
So you're saying NBC has a great Thursday lineup?
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How was the "Must See TV" days compatible? They had a smash hit at 8, everyone tuned out at 8:30, a smash hit at 9 and everyone tuned out at 9:30, and then a smash hit at 10. You call that compatible?
I'm trying to remember which NBC Thursday shows had zero viewers, actually.
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Oh yes, I am sure that people who have watched 30 Rock and have not liked it have decided that they won't watch any other NBC show. That makes a lot of sense.
You really don't get it--it's not about people deciding "I won't watch this network". It's about the network needing to hook people who have a lot of other options. And they'll never do that with shows like 30 Rock. It's been given a truly unprecedented amount of hype for a new show with low ratings--and it's failed to capitalize on it.
How low does it have to go before you admit it's a failure?
Actually, never mind what you admit--NBC is the one pouring money into a black hole.
I actually liked 30 Rock better than The Office last night just my opinion though. I don't really care too much about 30 Rock's ratings as long as it gets two more seasons and no more. Its ratings aren't good or bad anyway just eh, although much improved from what they used to be.
I've really been disapointed with The Office this season. It was my favorite show last year, but this season hasn't been up to par.
