They were a good idea in moderation ala Ugly Betty. Creatively they weren't much either. Some were better than others though and the last two were entertaining but slow moving. A night of them would've been good to complement the increasingly male-skewing schedule.

quote:

Originally posted by TV-aholic:

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:
Interesting how we're seeing more and more MNTV wins over CW. A couple decent shows averaging 3 million could start giving them weekly wins

Exactly. All they need to find is their "ANTM" and/or "Smackdown".

Even though I don't watch any shows on the net, it is nice to see them get things turned around into the right direction. Sorry Dumont & X, but those telenovels were just a terrible idea.

quote:

Originally posted by silver_rainbow:

quote:

Originally posted by samcat913:

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
The good news is that with Cashmere Mafia bombing, the likelyhood of Big Shots getting renewed skyrockets. Right now, CM is lucky to finish up what was filmed.

No chance of moving into a leadership position if all this crap is renewed. MIT should have been cancelled last season -- and there is no justification for returning marginal weak players, like WMC, PD and DSM.

You haven't mentioned SW -- which plummeted once it lost its Dancing lead-in. What they must do is rethink their entire program strategy if they hope to turn this ship around.

Neither show is returning. The shows that benefit from this show tanking are Pushing Daisies, Private Practice, and Dirty Sexy Money, all of which are more likely to return. Ditto for Men in Trees, which if it hits 7 million, will likely get at least another 13. I also think the likes of Wife Swap and Supernanny, which do very well away from Idol, will get renewed. Women's Murder Club as well because it pulls CBS-like audiences away from the eye on Fridays. All other returning shows will be back save for Jim, Notes, and October Road, which are goners. We may end up with Primetime getting a fall spot too.

I think SW will be the only comedy that ABC does renew for another season. As for dramas I think there are a lot of ones that are up in the air for renewel that ABC will consider, maybe not just based on ratings alone. I think the only drama pretty much guarenteed not to come back for another season is Big Shots. I think MiT, DSM, OR and WMC (maybe Cashmarie Mafia, too soon to tell) are all on the fence. I don't think ABC would want to get rid of all these at least not at this time not knowing how long the strike is really going to last.

I think ABC was pleased with the creative progress made by DSM. The full season pick up despite decreasing ratings proved that. I also think Pushing Daisies gets renewed for critical acclaim. If Arrested Development can get 3 seasons, this will get two. October Road has decreased creatively imo and is likely done. MIT depends all on the Wednesday airings. WMC likely comes back due to it hurting CBS and Samantha Who will likely rebound once it gets a more female skewing Dancing lead in back and ABC will no doubt renew it because it is the best comedy they have. Notes and the other comedies are all goners and Miss/Guided will likely be pushed back to fall.

Cashmere Mafia, According to Jim, Carpoolers, Cavemen, Notes from the Underbelly, October Road and Men In Trees will all be gone if ABC can get any sort of a pilot season going. Even without a pilot season, I don't see ABC picking them up. They drag the schedule down and have no purpose on the schedule.

Dirty Sexy Money has a slim shot at coming back. I read where one of the main producers got let go from ABC. So they will have to find another producer to carry on. I think it is as good as dead.

Pushing Daisies may have critical acclaim, but it's ratings have been declining. If it comes back, it will have to do better to get more than an additional 13.

Samantha Who is pretty much guarenteed to come back. Miss/Guided has all of their executive producers let go by ABC. Again, to be back on track, they will have to get a whole new set of producers. I don't expect it to ever air.

Big Shots saving grace is that it isn't doing as bad as some other dramas and they have a lot of cast and crew that ABC would like to see remain on staff. I think it will be spared and be given another 13. Now if it doesn't at least build in some way after the next 13, it's gone.

Dance Wars, Supernanny, Just for Laughts and Wife Swap will be back as filler/replacements.

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Big Shots saving grace is that it isn't doing as bad as some other dramas and they have a lot of cast and crew that ABC would like to see remain on staff. I think it will be spared and be given another 13. Now if it doesn't at least build in some way after the next 13, it's gone.

Big Shots is a disaster ratings wise. It fails to pull half of its lead in. If it were airing elsewhere, it would be pulling around 4 to 5 million. DSM and the other Wednesday shows all have good retention. Men in Trees has a very good shot seeing as how ABC moved it to a new night.

Men In Trees hasn't caught on in any timeslot. I think the chance that it will suddenly become a viable player for ABC is slim.

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Big Shots saving grace is that it isn't doing as bad as some other dramas and they have a lot of cast and crew that ABC would like to see remain on staff. I think it will be spared and be given another 13. Now if it doesn't at least build in some way after the next 13, it's gone.

Big Shots is a disaster ratings wise. It fails to pull half of its lead in. If it were airing elsewhere, it would be pulling around 4 to 5 million. DSM and the other Wednesday shows all have good retention. Men in Trees has a very good shot seeing as how ABC moved it to a new night.

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Men In Trees hasn't caught on in any timeslot. I think the chance that it will suddenly become a viable player for ABC is slim.

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Big Shots saving grace is that it isn't doing as bad as some other dramas and they have a lot of cast and crew that ABC would like to see remain on staff. I think it will be spared and be given another 13. Now if it doesn't at least build in some way after the next 13, it's gone.

Big Shots is a disaster ratings wise. It fails to pull half of its lead in. If it were airing elsewhere, it would be pulling around 4 to 5 million. DSM and the other Wednesday shows all have good retention. Men in Trees has a very good shot seeing as how ABC moved it to a new night.

Well actually MIT caught rather well on Thursdays, especially when you see how BS or OR did there

I don't agree with this logic. If Dirty Sexy Money is a goner, Big Shots is even more of a goner. The ratings for Big Shots were slightly worse overall and it had a better lead-in. If either of these shows is renewed, it's going to be DSM.

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Men In Trees hasn't caught on in any timeslot. I think the chance that it will suddenly become a viable player for ABC is slim.

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:

quote:

Originally posted by WelcomeToK-VilleAmericanGladiators:
Big Shots saving grace is that it isn't doing as bad as some other dramas and they have a lot of cast and crew that ABC would like to see remain on staff. I think it will be spared and be given another 13. Now if it doesn't at least build in some way after the next 13, it's gone.

Big Shots is a disaster ratings wise. It fails to pull half of its lead in. If it were airing elsewhere, it would be pulling around 4 to 5 million. DSM and the other Wednesday shows all have good retention. Men in Trees has a very good shot seeing as how ABC moved it to a new night.

Hey Marc, Did we get the 10 yet??

Series needing threads

Terminator: SCC
Extreme Makeover: Home Edition
Americas Funniest Videos
Cops
America's Most Wanted
48 Hours
Dateline
20/20

Also need Chasmere Mafia, Crowned: Mother/Pagent

averages (excl reruns); and keep in mind BS typically had a larger lead in:

week	day	date	network	show	       Repeat	 Viewers 	 18-49 
week 14	Wednesday	12/26/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money	r	 3,320 	 0.9 
week 12	Wednesday	12/12/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money	r	 3,670 	 1.2 
week 11	Wednesday	12/05/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 6,745 	 2.3 
week 10	Wednesday	11/28/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 7,043 	 2.6 
week 9	Wednesday	11/21/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 6,375 	 2.0 
week 8	Wednesday	11/14/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 7,903 	 2.9 
week 6	Wednesday	10/31/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 8,197 	 2.8 
week 5	Wednesday	10/24/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 8,264 	 3.1 
week 4	Wednesday	10/17/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 8,670 	 3.0 
week 3	Wednesday	10/10/07	abc	Dirty Sexy Money		 8,640 	 3.3 
week 2	Wednesday	10/03/07	abc	DIRTY SEXY MONEY		 9,610 	 3.5 
week 1	Wednesday	09/26/07	abc	DIRTY SEXY MONEY		 10,440 	 3.6 
week 16	Thursday	01/10/08	abc	Big Shots		            6,290 	 2.4 
week 10	Thursday	11/29/07	abc	Big Shots		            5,289 	 2.1 
week 7	Thursday	11/08/07	abc	Big Shots		            6,963 	 2.9 
week 6	Thursday	11/01/07	abc	Big Shots		            7,324 	 3.1 
week 5	Thursday	10/25/07	abc	Big Shots		            7,384 	 3.0 
week 4	Thursday	10/18/07	abc	Big Shots		            7,640 	 3.0 
week 3	Thursday	10/11/07	abc	Big Shots	                    	 8,540 	 3.6 
week 2	Thursday	10/04/07	abc	BIG SHOTS		            8,230 	 3.6 
week 1	Thursday	09/27/07	abc	BIG SHOTS		           11,100 	 4.5 

				Big Shots	(avg)      	 7,640 	 3.13 
				Dirty Sexy Money (avg)	 8,189 	 2.91 
  

quote:

Originally posted by TV-aholic:

quote:

Originally posted by mushu_jj:
Interesting how we're seeing more and more MNTV wins over CW. A couple decent shows averaging 3 million could start giving them weekly wins

Exactly. All they need to find is their "ANTM" and/or "Smackdown".

Even though I don't watch any shows on the net, it is nice to see them get things turned around into the right direction. Sorry Dumont & X, but those telenovels were just a terrible idea.

The telenovas failed, but at least they were an attempt to program a network in a new/different way. Currently, MNTV has moved to an almost all reality TV format (do they have a single scripted show on the air? All reality and movie buyouts aren't likely to ever get MNTV to a 'success story'. They are simply adopting the format of the cheap cable networks in order to stay afloat until they can figure out what they want to do.

quote:

Originally posted by Obveeus:The telenovas failed, but at least they were an attempt to program a network in a new/different way. Currently, MNTV has moved to an almost all reality TV format (do they have a single scripted show on the air? All reality and movie buyouts aren't likely to ever get MNTV to a 'success story'. They are simply adopting the format of the cheap cable networks in order to stay afloat until they can figure out what they want to do.

I think you hit the nail right on the head. The current MyTV lineup is just a way to get back in the BLACK, so to speak, from the failed telenovels. It may be a slow process getting back to scripted programs, but I would think we would see am hour or two of scripted programs next season.

Hopfully they can go the way of sitcoms instead of dramas.

quote:

Originally posted by samcat913:
there is no justification for returning marginal weak players, like WMC, PD and DSM.

Sure there is. ABC only has so much new product in the pipeline. They cannot get rid of twice as many shows as they plan to bring on as new for next fall.

IMO, these shows are the ones that will be gone: Cavemen, Carpoolers, Acording to Jim, Notes from the Underbelly, Big Shots, Cashmiere Mafia, October Road, Dirty Sexy Money, Men in Trees, and National Bingo Night.

Still left in the unknown pile are: Eli Stone and Miss/Guided.

Shows that are on the border, but are most likely going to return: Pushing Daisies, Women's Murder Club, Boston Legal, Supernanny, and Wife Swap.

quote:

Originally posted by bored striker:
Covering Reality, Animation, and getting the right to honor other guild's picket lines back (sympathy strike - which we used to have) were never important to the rank and file, they were mostly symbolic.

I'll believe that the sympathy strike demand was symbolic, but the WGA has been trying to get Reality TV covered for years. They really want that one, even if it does turn the stomachs of many 'real writers'.

quote:

As much as I believe the wga leaders are naive there's no doubt that the other side is responsible for the financial distress being brought to bear on the industry.

I disagree. If, as you believe, the deal will be made whenever AMPTP wants it made and all of the strike business was just a way for the studios/networks to purge junk deals and test reality TV, then why why WHY did the WGA ever go on strike to begin with? The strike was a mistake made by the WGA (this was not a lockout) and the financial distress for all those involved is the WGA's burden to bear.

quote:

Originally posted by TV-aholic:
Hey Marc, Did we get the 10 yet??

Series needing threads

Terminator: SCC
Extreme Makeover: Home Edition
Americas Funniest Videos
Cops
America's Most Wanted
48 Hours
Dateline
20/20

Also need Chasmere Mafia, Crowned: Mother/Pagent

Maybe we should have a contest:
which will happen first: Crowned gets a thread or Crowned has a season finale and is never seen again?

Side note: I posted the ratings for The Biggest Loser, but wasn't planning to take on the weekly updating task you so richly fulfill.

quote:

I disagree. If, as you believe, the deal will be made whenever AMPTP wants it made and all of the strike business was just a way for the studios/networks to purge junk deals and test reality TV, then why why WHY did the WGA ever go on strike to begin with? The strike was a mistake made by the WGA (this was not a lockout) and the financial distress for all those involved is the WGA's burden to bear.

You could make the same argument about any strike in history that wasn't a lockout (and most of them weren't).

So basically, you're saying that if nobody had ever gone on strike, everything would have been peachy-keen, because the bosses they just LOVE to give us peons a bigger piece of the pie.

WGA forced AMPTP to focus--DGA got a better deal because of the WGA strike--in no small part because with WGA having demonstrated how much of an impact it could have all by itself, the prospect of DGA and SAG striking at the same time was truly frightening.

The deal was never going to be made until AMPTP was ready, but it was also never going to be made until the talent showed that it was ready to walk.

It's always better to avoid a strike--if possible. I disagree with a lot of things WGA has done, and frankly I'm not overawed by the current roster of talent represented by that organization--but they had to force the issue at some point, and when they did, people were going to get hurt.

And if they didn't, people were going to get hurt in a slower and less dramatic way.

It's amazing to me, btw, that people get so heartsick about the financial tribulations of some middle class Americans, then go out and buy sneakers made by starving third world kids for a few bucks a day, and feel not the slightest tinge of guilt.

Nobody starved, nobody died, and if people overstretched themselves financially, then got into trouble when crunchtime came around (as it inevitably does), that's too bad--and it's happening EVERYWHERE. Not just in the entertainment industry.

The people who represent AMPTP are part of the social class that have led our economy into its current disaster zone with their disastrous incompetence and greed.

So go ahead and call me a commie.

Hey, maybe you could put me on a blacklist!

Oh wait, I don't actually work in entertainment.